cup cup sip sip yep yep YURR

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

It's been brought to my attention that we haven't had a thread about Electrik Red, despite them being seriously relevant to our interests for the last, err, year. So let's do that.

Here is a piece of largely irrelevant writing on the topic that I've spewed out in the last ten seconds, excuse my grammar:

So we're fairly used, by now, to the slew of whorepop that's appeared in the US girlgroup arena following the surprising success of My Secret Favourite Band, The Pussycat Dolls. It's a sort of delicate combination between sassiness and a brutal level of crudeness that crosses the 'sexy' line into almost emo morbidity levels in terms of 'excessive honesty.' Or TMI, whatever. I absolutely love all the whorepoppers, from the emotionally resonant 'Dolls to the straight-up skanks that are Girlicious to Danity Kane's stripper-in-an-empty-club routine; I partly like them because I frankly can't be getting along with good girls and I see them as an extension of, say, Courtney Love et al who I worshipped as an early teenager and also because the music is layered harmony awesomeness and the overall result is me finding a new favourite genre.

Still, they're not quite me. In the same way that Courtney Love is not quite me. I see what they're doing but I generally can just about keep my clothes from falling off and have a vague concept of how to use Twitter. Where I'm just not particularly respectable, these young ladies are no-nonsense, well-groomed slvts and well, I'm maybe just a little too lazy for that. Same way as I probably can't be bothered to marry Kurt Cobain, historical continuity problems aside. The Danities and the Courtneys and the Dolls are fvcked up in ways that I can relate to but through a sort of 'there is a general theory here which is relevant to the both of us' lens, rather than as a directly applicable thing.

Then there's Electrik Red; easily confusable for whorepop, insofar as they have the same brazen approach to lyrics and a certain propensity for not bothering to hide the fvcked up aspects of How They Roll but ...different. Where the PCDs now look almost Disney somehow (partly due to various bar-raising activities cf. Tila Tequila et al) and have acquired an air of good, clean fun, whilst the Danities implode and who the fuck knew what Girlicious were doing in the first place, Electrik Red are sort of ...real. They get drunk, they fvck innappropriate people, they get so emo they can't get out of bed, they have one of those weeks where you feel exactly in control of things for five minutes, they fvck themselves in the head with stupid men, etc.

I'm willing to concede that I'm never going to be that well-groomed but somehow Electrik Red feel like they're much more me. I was going to say 'girls like me' but I think I mean 'people,' occasional gender politics in their songs aside. The lyrical TMI gets the same heart-swelling-and-bursting formula right as, say, Pete Wentz or Conor Oberst does; a little too honest, a little too raw, a little too vicious and faintly embarassing for that. Sort of lyrical blogging, from the drunken Twitter updates of 'Drink In My Cup' to the epic thoughtmaze of 'So Good,' which is basically the sound of those thoughts that stop you dead in front of the kettle/telly/front door/etc. and temporarily take all your braneRAM for their own crush-y purposes. And then there's 'We Fvck You,' which is a really ballsy discussion with yr friends, instantly deleted by 'So Good' existing; whilst 'thought I wouldn't really give a fvck' =/= being the fvcker rather than the fvckee, there's a ho-rap hardness to WFY that all turns out to be bravado when the emo kicks in, which isn't because they're grills or whatever, it's because most people are actually kind of emo and the gender-political posturing turns out to just be rubbish because you can relate to boys after all etc. WHICH IS AWESOME.

I know I'm probably DOIN IT RONG by revelling in the emo aspects of slvtpop but 'Bed Rest' is seriously amazing;

And they swear all over the place, whilst somehow managing to actually look quite big and clever. As part of the Eminem generation, I obviously think swearing is a brilliant idea: V GOOD, TICK.

Anyway, I should probably do some work and this is absolute nonsense, so DISCUSSION: GO. Feel free to post details of yr own relation to (or dislocation from) the 'Red.

Comments

i'm not a stripper but i dance like that

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

I just remembered how FVCKING AMAZING 'Muah' is-


I'm not a freak, I'm not a nasty ho' -well I'm lying but I'm classy, tho

and also I'm not a ditz I got a brain; you see my titties before you see my face; it's all good nigga don't be ashamed, i would feel the same cus you know I know I'm the sh1t with this sh1t -k so sometimes I think I relate to whorepop particularly because, tbh, I am reasonably hot and used to be fancied loads when I was a teenager but this is such an awesome deconstruction of flirtation. Like, 'ok, yes, you're looking, fair play' >>>>>>>>Avril Lavigne beating someone in the head for checking out her tits. And yes, I get upset about builders etc. too but y'know, context. 'Muah' is like the 'grown up, got over it, feel more in control' version of 'Beep' by the PCD. ♥ ♥ ♥

Re: i'm not a stripper but i dance like that

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

Binkie's rap on 'Muah' is 100% incredible and about as concise a summation of Electrik Red as you'll get.

Now tell me what you really gonna do with that
Never seen a girl with an ass so phat
I'm not a stripper but I dance like that
I'm not a stripper but WHERE THE MONEY AT!!!
I'm not a freak, I'm not a nasty ho -
Well I'm lyin', but I'm classy tho
I'm like you, I wanna get-get-get it
To the bedroom, hit-hit-hit it
I'm not a ditz, I got a brain
You saw my tittays before you see my face
It's all good nigga, don't be shamed
I would feel the same
Cuz I know you know!

Re: i'm not a stripper but i dance like that

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

I really like how much of a manifesto 'Muah' is. It really is literally an instruction manual on how to be a lady on Electrik Red's terms.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

I liked this post a lot and think more ppl should comment. But honestly I don't really listen to the lyrics much on the ER album, I mean apart from sthing like "We Fuck You" and "P Is For Power" where they jump out at you a bit. I couldn't tell you what "So Good" is about, aside from obviously someone/something being so good. And probably not specifically so good at knitting, or differential calculus.

Pete Wentz lyrics seem completely un-emo to me though! His stuff is all about the OMG thrill of finding the perfectly outrageously OTT way to express Emo, giving his fans a kind of performative psychic toolkit. Exactly like Morrissey did back in my day, except FOB rock harder.

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

Nooooo FOB lyrics are GREBT because they are all about Pete and Patrick, really. Not in an omgfanfiction way, in the sense that it's their mentalist friendship that's the real thing; Patrick telling Pete to pull it together and Pete telling Patrick to fvck off and etc. Really the Wentz comparison is more about the ...overrealism of some things, like in 'So Good,' where she's like 'thought I wouldn't really give a fvck, now a b1tch all in love' is sort of... too close to the bone, somehow, like too much of a vulnerable admission because of the persona of Electrik Red? [ed: and the relevance to this w/r/t FOB is stuff like 'why don't you show me the little bit of spine you've been saving for his mattress/I only want sympathy in the form of you crawling into bed with me' where it's like '...too much, Pete, even for you'] Idk idk idk blee that Lady Gaga thing has fried what remained of my brain.

I have noticed that the people more wild about the lyrics seem generally more madly enthusiastic about ER (and by this I mean 'me and Cis and Lex were having a fanpersonism squee regarding their brilliance the other day in the pub' although as me and katstevens were discussing, not something you want to get caught singing in the cantine queue by accident.

Tbh I've pretty much accepted that discussion posts are met with general apathy. We have trained people to tick boxes too well. Also, harder to read at werk.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

Oh I love the record for its sound, just couldn't quote any of it.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

And those Wentz lyrics don't seem too much or anything, they're like Elvis Costello but done with web-era performative flair. It's not that I think Wentz is fakin' the emo or anything, just that "relating to" his lyrics isn't a deal for me. But on the other hand it kind of IS, because FOB totally glamorises those kind of situations, like some pop glamorises violence, so listening gives you a kind of wounded swagger.

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

I think tbh I just thought of that line because it seemed like what might happen if Pete circa Cork Tree shagged Electrik Red circa 'Bed Rest.' (ie: FACEPALM ALL ROUND)

My brain is not really working today, though.

[cis.livejournal.com]

Nooooo FOB lyrics are GREBT because they are all about Pete and Patrick, really. Not in an omgfanfiction way, in the sense that it's their mentalist friendship that's the real thing; Patrick telling Pete to pull it together and Pete telling Patrick to fvck off and etc.

this is exactly what someone could say about The Libertines!

v few FOB lyrics are about Pete and Patrick you fanfictual mentalist, they are majority Conor Oberst-style 'pete and girls he has slept with or will sleep with' or 'pete and pete'.

[cis.livejournal.com]

genuinely i am having a lot of difficulty thinking of any lyrics that can be assumed to be about Patrick w/out tinhattery!

on the other hand I did just remember that that 'bang the doldrums' is apparently canonically about Mikey out of MCR.

(obviously 'girls he has slept with or will sleep with' includes 'the ~fans~' not because he will sleep with them but because in the fangirl's heart there must always a suggestion of 'you too could be like peyton in one tree hill' even if the thought is faintly offputting)

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

Weeeell yes. Although 'Folie A Deux' is JUST Pete/Patrick, really. And retrospectively, quite a lot of the rest probably is. You could say it about a lot of bands, really. It's just I LIKE Pete and Patrick.

Cus Patrick sings them, he always ends up tied up in it, anyway. The fact of Pat singing them is always going to mean Pete's putting the criticisms of himself into Patrick's mouth and ...oh, I should just write the thing I keep trying to remember to write about this but it always comes out a bit fannish and I don't actually really know that much about FOB beyond the music.

I do not read FOB fanfic! At work, anyway...

[cis.livejournal.com]

if you have fanfic in your heart you do not need to read it! AS EVIDENCED HERE.

Folie a Deux is pretty much Pete/fans? occasionally Pete/fame? Briefly Youth Of America/Obama?

It's funny, "[lyricist] puts self-criticism into mouth of [singer]" is true of a bunch of bands, it was true of the Manics on their few confessional-ish songs but it was never James Dean Bradfield people went about slashing. (genuinely sometimes it seems like the collective fangirl unconsciousness just goes 'pick two most photogenic members: press play', though tbf this sort of thing always seems to be based on a lot of interview burble/'all rock n roll is homosexual' shirtsharing)

I'm sure there is a mentalist friendship between the two that's part of the context of their songs, but there's only one of them writing the lyrics here. One emo dude is putting both self-accusations and self-justifications into his best friend's mouth, so there's a funny frisson there, but there's nothing resembling the "here is a straight-up push-pull relationship between two best friends" of The Libertines' Can't Stand Me Now.

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

Idk idk idk idk cus they have explicitly said that Folie A Deux is the sound of them deconstructing their friendship. I think. Have I mentioned that I occasionally make huge sweeping assumptions apropos of absolutely nothing? *facedesk*

Tbh the entire comparison stems from having my iPhone on shuffle on the bus to work. *is in no way impulsive or irrational*

Bandslash is so philosophical. It is odd. And a bit awesome, obviously, because I am sucker for philosophy but it does seem so much more self-aware than other fanfic, possibly because as you say, it's sort of 'APROPOS OF NOTHING.' Oh idk, I am so not into fandom really so I'm probably just looking at it at the wrong angle or something.

[cis.livejournal.com]

to be fair i don't really read FOB interviews so-- idk.

I dunno I still thought the original point, this:
"The lyrical TMI gets the same heart-swelling-and-bursting formula right as, say, Pete Wentz or Conor Oberst does; a little too honest, a little too raw, a little too vicious and faintly embarassing for that."

is a really interesting one! I have for quite a while been wondering if there was anything in the idea of boy-emo and male r'n'b as corollaries, what they say about different forms of masculinity, different ways of showing masculine weakness, different relationships between emotionality and polish, etc. And ER are kind of 'male r'n'b done by girls'!

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

argh I have a reply to this but have accidentally called in IS services on myself so have to look like i'm working.

basically: i agree.

[ms-bracken.livejournal.com]

I CANNOT BELIEVE I MISSED THIS DISCUSSION, but quickly - I have always read Pete / fans lyrics as Pete / Patrick lyrics because of the dynamic where one writes and the other sings. So there's the same process of interpretation and misinterpretation, but the assumed closeness (of a fan to a boy in a band xe likes) is an actually closeness (two boys in a band).

Anyway will GET BACK TO WORK and / or listen to ER now...

[bengraham.livejournal.com]

Tbh I've pretty much accepted that discussion posts are met with general apathy. We have trained people to tick boxes too well.

Sometimes it's not just apathy. I read this post, found it very interesting, makes me want to check out the ER album, but aside from that, I have nothing particularly useful to add to the debate, so I'll keep quiet.

Just because it doesn't get hundreds of comments like a poll doesn't mean ppl aren't reading.

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

Well yes, I am just being grumpy because I'm bored and katstevens isn't around for me to annoy.

[edgeofwhatever.livejournal.com]

Same. Additionally, a lot of times stuff has already been discussed, on other people's journals and whatnot, before it finally surfaces here, so I'm sort of discussioned out. (In this case, Lex has already quoted everything they've ever done on every website ever, and I said my piece in my "So Good" blurb and comment over at the Jukebox (http://www.thesinglesjukebox.com/?p=390), and at this point I am unable to formulate additional thoughts about them.)

[edgeofwhatever.livejournal.com]

Uh, and I was going to conclude that comment by saying maybe we should all make more of an effort to post stuff we want to talk about here, rather than on our own journals/Tumblrs/Twitters/etc.

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

I'm going to comment but am on deadline (and started an Electrik Red thread on ILM yesterday so a bit talked out about them) - lyrics are so key to their appeal though, every song has at least 5 lines that just turn me into a quote machine. 'So Good' has that brilliant "I thought I wouldn't really give a fuck, but now a bitch all in love" for starters, the entire song is perfect at capturing the tension that ensues when you find yourself totally into someone who you thought was just a casual fling, and mildly resenting them for having melted your defences. I have "ooh shit damn" in my head for approximately 20 hours per day.

like my first name's Betty

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

Hahahahaha yes. At first I was like 'why the fvck is this the single' but it's probably my, like, third favourite song by them (w/ 'Drink In My Cup' & 'Muah' coming higher up -WHY IS 'MUAH' NOT A SINGLE YET, JEBUS) because it's just so fvcking... I dunno, I had a huge emo to it the other day because I vaguely fail at life but also because it's got that sexy summery jam strut and actually it's in about as bad a way as Fantasia in 'When I See U'.

It's about the only song of theirs that Mariah could do, too.

I actually cannot type today. I blame werk.

Re: like my first name's Betty

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

The thread I started was a poll thread on "which is your favourite single on the album" (http://www.ilxor.com/ILX/ThreadSelectedControllerServlet?boardid=41&threadid=74525#unread). I honestly couldn't say. ALL OF THEM. Seriously. The only ones not in contention are the 'So Good' remix and maybe '9 To 5'.

I mean...even when they're not being all ::QUOTABLE:: and shit, they're still amazing lyrics. Something as simple as "expose my devotion to you" - just conveys so many levels of emotion, the defenses and the suspicion and the neediness and the vulnerability and the tenderness and the care.

For ref, the original ILX thread on the album (http://www.ilxor.com/ILX/ThreadSelectedControllerServlet?boardid=41&threadid=72501).

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

Part of the problem is that I've forgotten how to empathise with any lyrics that don't discuss who's going to do the night feed and whether we're out of wipes or not.

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

This may be a fair point.

[meserach.livejournal.com]

See, it's interesting about needing empathy to get lyrics.

Like, I have nothing at all in common with Electrik Red's lyrics in general: I like to dance but that's about it. But I enjoy them a lot as a description of a lifestyle, perhaps as a commentary, or as vicarious experience.

However to really LOVE a lyric (rather than like it, respect it, thing it clever or funny or amazing), I do have to emppathise with it somewhat.

I rarely directly empathise with a song lyric because they're usually too specific, but I have to find some channel of empathy. A good example this year is Royksopp "The GIrl and The Robot" which I ahve come to love since really attending to its lyrics, but not because they describe my situation as such but because I empathise with parts of it (oddly enough, from the robot's side of the equation rather than the girl's, but that's another thread).

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

i wish for the video they had gone with 'the robot' in question actually being a, gasp, human too

[meserach.livejournal.com]

Literalism was the safe way to go, yeah.

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

The chord change on 'Bed Rest' may well be the sexiest moment in pop this year.

He don't wanna talk about where I been, I don't wanna talk about what he did

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

Rule 1: No pop-pop-popping up unannounced
Rule 2: Never leave your clothes at my house
Rule 3: Can't speak if you see me when I'm out
Rule 4: You can't stay past 5, I gotta be at work by 9!

Re: He don't wanna talk about where I been, I don't wanna talk about what he did

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

I was quite tempted to put this in my lj userinfo the other day but decided it might give out the wrong impression.

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

"As part of the Eminem generation, I obviously think swearing is a brilliant idea: V GOOD, TICK."

As part of the NWA generation I concur!


The "whore" aspect of all this doesn't do much for me tho tbh and it's surely only represents at most half of what they're about. As a means of distinguishing them from other acts with similar emotional and romantic content I guess it works tho, and is probably important (tho not to me - it's just not what interests me about this music so glad there are other ways to get into it).

I keep thinking back to "Whatta Man" and similar tracks from all those years ago and how ER probably represent En Vogue and Salt n' Pepa combined into a single force. Both gave good sass and sexuality but in slightly different ways. In this process ER lose the vocal prowess of the more trad/soulful En Vogue but gain the egregious 'tood of SnP without having to rap a lot (or at least not as much as TLC, who may a better comparison really as far as their position goes).

Reason I mention those 90s acts is because I'm not sure how much ER (and we should also be talking about Richgirl altho they don't seem to have an album yet so that's tuffer) advance that schtick, tho they certainly match it for quality and that would be enough. I guess they ramp up the naughtiness outside of a more hip-hop context tho (including more use of the n word, which I brought up on a previous poptimists thread).

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

I don't really know anything about En Vogue, due to being about 12 and having spent the nineties being a horrible rockist anyway but I can sort of see what you mean about ER being more them than, say, the PCDs. I think what I like about all these girlgroups is that they're harking back to something pre-Spice Girls, who I hate.

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

En Vogue were always REALLY classy (tho). Yeah, ER have the attitude of S'n'P - or rappers generally; Jordan pointed out on ILM that the 'Drink In My Cup' lyrics were basically Young Dro/Gucci Mane lines being harmonised by four girls. TLC are a much more apposite comparison, what with that combination of explicit, proud wantonness and smart, in-control righteousness.

Of course the actual best comparison is Vanity 6, with The-Dream as the Prince figure - though Electrik Red's history suggests that they're far more responsible for their image than Vanity 6 were.

Pull the pin and throw the grenade

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

May as well post the AMAZING Richgirl single here too (Richgirl being Rich Harrison's current girl group project). Commentary at the Jukebox (http://www.thesinglesjukebox.com/?p=949), A+ video, one of the singles of the year, you need this in your life. Apparently their sales make the gigantic commercial flop that is Electrik Red seem like Destiny's Child :(

Re: Pull the pin and throw the grenade

[meserach.livejournal.com]

Yes this is so great (although I was slow, as the comments thread linked to demonstrates, to get used to the off key nature of the vocals). But the bass is just so HUGE.

wiggle wiggle wiggle girl

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

I only just bothered to listen to this, due to having been too emo-flailfaced to do anything useful for the last week really and WHOA. Those machine-gun beats and the hair flailing and the shouting and the fourteen choruses. TICKTICKTICKTICKTICKTICKTICK. Wish I'd played this at Poptimism.

Re: wiggle wiggle wiggle girl

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

Huzzah!

[cis.livejournal.com]

I really, really love the Electrik Red album: it's musically fantastic, it's endlessly quotable, I enjoy the image. I also have huge problems with it. I'm going to do a kogan here and repost something I wrote under f-lock in Lex's lj a month-odd ago:

when they talk about how they're earning it's pretty much always in the context of "i make more than you so step up your game and buy me shit or i won't let you fuck me". I totally enjoy that why-spend-mine-when-i-can-spend-yours trope in rnb lyrics! But basically because it has 0 relevance to my life: the way i was brought up suggested that having even a drink bought for you was giving more ground than a self-respecting woman should. So it's fun, to me, because these people are playing with the idea of sex as a commercial transaction and being brassy about it, which is totally alien to me and basically seems like fantasy to me because I am pretty much well out of it.

I mean on the one hand yes 'having self respect about yr sexuality and not settling for little boys who don't make paper' is a good message in that it's not 'he hit me and it felt like he loved me' or indeed not creepy s. shapiro-style passivity, but at the same time--

It means I'm in the funny position where the weakness of "Bed Rest" and "So Good" is for me preferable to the strength of "On Point" or "P is for Power", because being all laid up emo ditzing around a kitchen cos you miss a guy doesn't stick in my craw half as much as "if you wanna see the P let me see those dollar signs" does.

[piratemoggy.livejournal.com]

yes; i was going to say earlier actually, that is where they stop being like me. cus i like ER as neurotic masculinised wimmins wot drink etc. and it really a)throws me a curve ball and b)bothers the shit out of me every time they turn the money thing on. apart from anything else, it jars so badly with the rest of the aesthetic. v annoying! i was trying to work out from the older song lex posted yesterday if it was maybe something the-dream added or always theirs, i suspect the former.

[meserach.livejournal.com]

Yeah so everything I hear of Elctrik Red is just so totally amazing.

Hoeveer lyrically I can;t say I identify with Elctrik Re dat all, but I do ENJOY the lyrics. I am not really sure why - I am not entirely sure I would like the answers - but if nothing else they are audacious and witty and clever in their description of a lifestyle which is to me largely alien.