pop-as-sound vs pop-as-ethos

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

This is something which came up a) between Gareth and I last night at Lovelife, and b) in the comments box of the last post in the wake of Sweden's first round upset/The Knife's dominance of the pie thingy.

It's been noticeable recently (over the past year or so definitely) that the ahem 'online pro-pop community' seems to have collectively decided that 'pop' is a fixed sonic genre: synth-based, very gay (large elements of androgyny and burlesque), very white (a deliberate move away from turn-of-the-century r&b-influenced pop eg Britney, Xtina), and Swedish for preference. I don't like much of this stuff as I find it all very bloodless - those I approve of (Annie, The Knife) often have a harder electro edge, but for the most part it's incredibly unimaginative and wimpy (Bodies Without Organs, those terrible people whose entire career seems to be based on covering the Pet Shop Boys) - and as we all know, WIMPY = INDIE.

But surely the entire point of 'pop', the point of music made with commercial impact in mind, is that it can never be rooted in any particular sound: it's anything and everything which cannibalises anything and everything else, leading to sonic results all over the musical map. It's an ethos rather than a genre - I think the scattergun Xenomania approach typifies it quite well - which means that the pop umbrella can cover everything it or you or the public wants it to.

How do you view pop? And what's your view on the trend towards wimpy, bloodless Scandinavians being held up as some sort of ULTIMO-POP?

Comments

[dickmalone.livejournal.com]

"synth-based, very gay (large elements of androgyny and burlesque), very white (a deliberate move away from turn-of-the-century r&b-influenced pop eg Britney, Xtina), and Swedish for preference"

STRAW MAN.

There has been an unusual amount of good Swedish pop lately but that doesn't mean people think of pop as being Swedish Lex!

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

I have seen SEVERAL people go ON AND BLOODY ON about Sweden recently, often while referring to dreadful limp synthpop!

[boyofbadgers.livejournal.com]

Who are these SEVERAL PEOPLE, because I haven't been reading them?

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

RacistJustice for one!

[boyofbadgers.livejournal.com]

Oh. Them. *shrug*

I honestly don't pay any attention to them anymore.

[dickmalone.livejournal.com]

Oh sure, but most people also seem to think that pop is pretty dismal right now, so it makes a certain amount of sense that they're going farther afield and/or narrower.

I'm with you as to pop's wide net, of course, and I've really been enjoying all the girl-group pop-rock we've been getting, but I can also see how people might not be talking much about R&B-inflected pop in a time when they don't think there's much good R&B-inflected pop around.

[dickmalone.livejournal.com]

I mean, I'd love more stuff to listen to, so if you have any Britney-style pop hanging around we haven't heard, bring that shit out...

(And remind me not to start all my comments with "Oh sure")

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

I don't think r&b is in a particularly bad state at the moment! Rihanna, Ciara, Amerie, Brooke Valentine...I'm not sure why these people, despite making poppy chart-friendly dancefloor-friendly commercially successful music, are Not Pop whereas Robyn, who makes Imbruglia-lite acoustic ballads which don't even get properly released outside her native country, is somehow the Embodiment Of Pop.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

You see here's the problem I have - who exactly is claiming Ciara, Rhianna etc as Not Pop?

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

Well this is where the somewhat nebulous 'online pro-pop community' rears its head - but basically there are people who are avowed Fans Of Pop and we know who and where they are (RacistJustice message board for one) and they are very definite that it is Pop which they like...and they, by and large, reject Ciara, Rihanna etc.

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

what about R&B men Lex? which blingin' geezers are you feeling, if any?

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

hmm...Usher, definitely. There is a boy called Chris Brown who has a bubblecrunk song I saw on the TV in a shop which I liked? And I liked that Bobby Valentino song from last year.

R&B has v much traditionally been the feminine music to hip hop's masculine music though.

[martinskidmore.livejournal.com]

I am of the opinion that Chris Brown needs to get Mike Jones in for a guest verse, and we will force Cabbage and Steady Mike into a karaoke kover version.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

It's not totally a straw man. There's an MP3 blog called Sounds Of Sweden (not AFAIK run by a swede), Popjustice makes an ironic joke of its sweden-fetishism, and so on.

[dickmalone.livejournal.com]

Oh sure, but just because most people in 2003 were talking about crunk when they were talking about hip-hop didn't mean they thought all hip-hop was crunk.

[dubdobdee.livejournal.com]

where is the love for SOUNDS OF NORWAY!!