(188 comments)

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

The recent Now polls have been total blockbusters in terms of comments - and lots of votes too. This runs us up against the technical limits of LJ, i.e. that an over-50 comments thread is a chore to read, and a 2-page one requires particular dedication even beyond that. Not much we can do about that, other than pass the thematic ball forward more often (i.e. start new threads).

So why's it happening? Well Poptimists is bigger now, and this is a period we all remember, and a lot of us were online then and fighting various crucial ideological pop battles (ahem) and so there's an urge to either defend territory hard-won - or complicate history by asking questions which Pop Fervour made us less likely to pose at the time.

It's interesting* that there's a definite hard kernel of a 00s Pop Canon there - after poll after poll with winning scores in the 70s, Britney, Kylie, S Club, Destiny's all post scores of 90%-ish, and I can think of a few more tracks that are likely to do similar. (Obviously a lot of this is a quirk of demographics - we've set up a community where ppl who like that sort of thing can wander in.)

*especially cos of the relative lack of majority-votes and high-scorers for the current month polls stevem runs - has pop got worse, or just more diverse?

Comments

[atommickbrane.livejournal.com]

Just let me do a couple of concurrent Shine polls. WE'LL GET THAT READERSHIP DOWN.

[zenith.livejournal.com]

I have no evidence for this, but does pop usually only get really good in Summer, every year?

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

they get more votes than the NOW polls tho!

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

i say no. all the best stuff comes out in March and October!

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

I am very keen on Poptimists being bigger!

I wish LJ would introduce a 'paid community' option though which could get rid of threaded comments (among other things)

[blue-russian.livejournal.com]

Tom, methinks now would also be a good moment to get a picture of the poptimist age distribution, because I think that would suggest something as well. The age brackets would have to be fairly narrow (i.e., none of this 25-34 nonsense).

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

'Hung Up'
'Push The Button'
'I Said Never Again (But Here We Are)'

from last year alone! never underestimate the power of the Xmas party market.

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

I am keen on Poptimists being bigger but not if this means getting people in who won't vote for Christina Milian or Mary J Blige!

[blue-russian.livejournal.com]

Yes, I hate the threaded comments, too. When you peak in and there are already 88 comments, most of the time I skip over them rather than open each little set.

[celentari.livejournal.com]

I'd be lying if I said the age I was for some of these high scoring Britney/Kylie hits didn't affect my affection for them. But for me, nostaligia, even nostaligia as recent as last week, is a big part of my Pop Love. Whereas more "serious" music I'm more likely to have listened to alone and it thus seems more objectively judgeable.

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

i think more time needs to pass perhaps. i wonder if 'Crazy' would get over 50 ticks, 3 or 4 years from now. not that my polls attract that many people :(

as discussed last week this is partly because people seem to have trouble keeping up to date with the chart and it's contents now. because they've grown increasingly intolerant of radio and press practices and because they're older/busier it seems.

but i think we may be in a period akin to a 'middle of album dip' - many of the bigger stars are in decline now inc. Britney, Beyonce and esp. Eminem. GA, Madonna and Sugababes released album tracks from '05 this year. There's been no real massive anthems from big stars (old or new) this year, yet - but i suppose that does tie in with Summer aspect.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

It's quite young, I remember from the last time we did this.

[juliet]

NB: anyone who uses Firefox, there's a Greasemonkey script called LJ Thread Unfolder, which on (most, but not quite all) journal styles will give you an extra link entitled 'Unfold'. Clicking this unfolds the thread in place, rather than opening a new page.

Another useful Greasemonkey script for navigating LJ comments:
http://pw201.livejournal.com/54000.html
This one changes the 'X Comments' link into 'X comments (y comments new)', & when you open the page, allows you to hit 'n' & 'p' to navigate to the next/previous unseen comment.

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

I think every year feels like this a bit - there are good singles in the first half but they mostly seem to be either a) hangovers from last year's albums eg 'Whole Lotta History' OR b) time-lagged US hits from the previous year eg 'Goodies'. But 2006 is already kicking into gear! Xtina obv, and I suspect Beyoncé has something up her sleeve too...

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

i still haven't heard the Xtina altho i did download the YSI on ILM before removing it, heh

[atommickbrane.livejournal.com]

The LJ Mafiosa works in mysterious ways, Several Members of this very community know someone whose job may well involve doing such things!

[bengraham.livejournal.com]

i wonder if 'Crazy' would get over 50 ticks, 3 or 4 years from now

I think it probably would. I'd liken it to Outkast's Ms. Jackson, which as proven in the most recent Now poll still holds plenty of appeal. 'Crazy' is the sort of tune that will sound fresh for a very long time (as long as they stop playing it constantly now that it's been knocked off the top of the charts).

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

but it does have a greater ubiquity than 'Miss Jackson' which was big but since overshadowed by 'Hey Ya', which everyone DID get sick of!

can see 'Crazy' being thought of more along 'Hey Ya' lines basically, altho perhaps retaining a bit more favour as it's somehow more 'credible' and cooler.

[carsmilesteve.livejournal.com]

gah, this sounds lovely but as most of my ljing takes place at work, no chance of firefox :(

[zenith.livejournal.com]

I think it stays good for the rest of the year! It's just the January drought can drag on as far as April...

[byebyepride.livejournal.com]

I think pop IS worse at the moment, actually: or at least pop defined as 'what's in the charts / on radio 1' where with a few exceptions Koganesque teenpop is largely absent. I also think this was a predictable development, and I don't think it will necessarily last.

Reasons: more and more, increasingly narrow niche markets develop, with own systems of distribution, and critical forums. Hence the centre ground is evacuated and becomes full of lowest common denominator, allowing gatekeepers (BBC, mainly) who have learnt to adapt and ride the repetitions of the pop marketplace, to have a stranglehold. LCD at moment = indie; rock; some urban crossover, but not half as much as say 2000-3. The space for novelty records is still there, but they depend on Radio 1 approval e.g. Elton John and Leo Sayer revivals. There seems to be a strict rationing of how many banging trance / house hits get in the charts, presumably related to rationing of slots on various radio playlists.

Not sure why I think it won't last -- probably lingering belief in dialectics.

[miss-newham.livejournal.com]

More diverse, I think. There's a lot more of what I still think of as indie bands troubling the charts now - unfortunately I don't think most of them are much cop.

[alexmacpherson.livejournal.com]

Haha this sums up in one paragraph a lot of the confused thoughts I have been having re the charts for the past year now - the whys and wherefores etc. Centre ground being evacuated the key concept.

My vague ray of hope for the current state of play not lasting has to do with how exciting and forward-thinking dance music has been for the past few years - when this starts to filter into pop (a process which always takes a few years with dance, because there's no chart-hunger in the genre at all) (and it arguably is already: I hear 'Body Language' by Booka Shade all the time these days in the most unexpected places; Body Language by Kylie was the first minimal house/pop crossover album; even hip-hop is going minimal, stuff like the new LL/J-Lo is virtually minimal techno) - anyway yes, when this starts to flter into pop in the same way that 2-step infected pop to the extent that Liberty X scored unexpected No 1s by using it as a template, then things will Get Good again.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

I like the theory - unfortunately Body Language was rubbish. :(

[chezghost.livejournal.com]

agree with all this

trouble a-brewin!