(no subject)
Jun. 5th, 2006 12:55 pm![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
anthonyeaston.livejournal.com posting in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png){kind=small}
poptimistsI think that Courtney Love's Moono wouldnt have been the most extreme song on american life, if it wasnt for the amazing, strange video, that video for me is so important, because it bridges the witchy woman stevie nix/punk rock queen past with something "new".
i think that what is extreme about some of the examples below, is an awareness of their own artifice and their own realness, and how those depth bombs of concepts can be used in concordance... (so life despite god, while a masterpeice, is too earnest and not artifical enough, to be extreme)
(so using yr inital examples:
Mariah Carey--her hyper femminity, of course, but also using the edges of her instrument, and the sheer, crystaline, theatricality of that instrument, i want wayne kaustenbaum to write about carey, because in the 1991 period, she made herself an icon of craft, but she knew that an icon was being made, her diva like tendencies were considered to be part of not only an r and b tradition but something else entirely. their voices sound different, but in this peroid carey reminded me of nothing more then callas, and callas knew what she was doing (she was too crafty in fact, compare callas losing aristotle to jackie, with carey losing motalla to thalia)
Napoleon XIV's i have not heard this.
The Veronicas' "4ever" The veronicas realise that its perfectly okay to want to be a pop star and a punk star at the same time, to be coy and to fuck. there are threads of this in britney, but she was never punk enough and in avril but you never wanted to fuck her, and in ashlee but their is an autonomy missing. you know where joe simpson is in lala for example, you dont know where max martin is (does out svengaling the svengali have something to do with this?)
Boney M is not extreme for being eccletic, boney m is extreme for being so fucking weird. personal anecdote, when i was a teenager, i went to offically sanctioned lds dances, for all three years of high school, and there were large group dances, and slow dances, but also a strange attempt to control the eroticism of the situtation, it was the first place where i realised that eroticism of popular culture couldnt be contained, that it was forever leaking over the edges. we would dance to songs that seemed so out of it, so strange, and it shocked me that they were allowed, they included time warp, rasputin, ymca. i still dont know how a song about cruising in the bathrooms of a working class mens club got so huge, and i have no idea why time warp was allowed, but it was incredibly fun to dance to, but rasputin...rasputin allowed all of these tight, hard, cold, scared boys and girls (scared of sex, of pleasure, of the end of the world, of all sorts of things, the culture of the church was always a kind of paranoid fear) to dance in this theatrical, overly dramatic way, we acted int his kind of music hall pantomine, and at the end the bodies were stacked like cordwood into the next song--like rasputin was a kind of heretical mystical reworking of jesus, we were playing the same game, dying and rising again, like we would at the end of the world. i dont know if boney m meant any of that, but the self concicous theatricality of it gave us something before missions and marriages. (maybe thats what im talking about here, self concious theatricality)
Richard Harris' Wrong Song (Donna Summers version is the correct version of this song) the song you are thinking of wrt Harris is the Hive
Lindsay Lohan's video for "Confessions of a Broken Heart (Daughter to Father)" (this is the first video for a pop song that i ever turned off because it was too close to tabloid violence, it isnt reflective at all, and the theraticality is stage managed, the slippages are too raw to be extreme, the blood doesnt come from cornstarch and food colouring; i think what you might be looking for is the britney video for lucky, which does everything about fame that lohan's video does, but more knowingly, or britneys everytime, which talks about internal violence more theatrically) (or maybe im just obessed with how much the wounds in the video look like stigmata)
Johnny Ray (havent heard him enough)
The Shangri-Las were the place i started to love pop more then anything else, it was the place that let me into super pop...the sheer overwrought emotion, the real violence, the silence at the edges (is walking in the sand really about rape?), all makes it extreme, what might make it not is a dependence on authority figures (esp mothers, in the text and phil spector outside the text)
Little Richard for sure (what happens with the exteremity of little richard with the evil hoodoo of pat boone?)
i think that what is extreme about some of the examples below, is an awareness of their own artifice and their own realness, and how those depth bombs of concepts can be used in concordance... (so life despite god, while a masterpeice, is too earnest and not artifical enough, to be extreme)
(so using yr inital examples:
Mariah Carey--her hyper femminity, of course, but also using the edges of her instrument, and the sheer, crystaline, theatricality of that instrument, i want wayne kaustenbaum to write about carey, because in the 1991 period, she made herself an icon of craft, but she knew that an icon was being made, her diva like tendencies were considered to be part of not only an r and b tradition but something else entirely. their voices sound different, but in this peroid carey reminded me of nothing more then callas, and callas knew what she was doing (she was too crafty in fact, compare callas losing aristotle to jackie, with carey losing motalla to thalia)
Napoleon XIV's i have not heard this.
The Veronicas' "4ever" The veronicas realise that its perfectly okay to want to be a pop star and a punk star at the same time, to be coy and to fuck. there are threads of this in britney, but she was never punk enough and in avril but you never wanted to fuck her, and in ashlee but their is an autonomy missing. you know where joe simpson is in lala for example, you dont know where max martin is (does out svengaling the svengali have something to do with this?)
Boney M is not extreme for being eccletic, boney m is extreme for being so fucking weird. personal anecdote, when i was a teenager, i went to offically sanctioned lds dances, for all three years of high school, and there were large group dances, and slow dances, but also a strange attempt to control the eroticism of the situtation, it was the first place where i realised that eroticism of popular culture couldnt be contained, that it was forever leaking over the edges. we would dance to songs that seemed so out of it, so strange, and it shocked me that they were allowed, they included time warp, rasputin, ymca. i still dont know how a song about cruising in the bathrooms of a working class mens club got so huge, and i have no idea why time warp was allowed, but it was incredibly fun to dance to, but rasputin...rasputin allowed all of these tight, hard, cold, scared boys and girls (scared of sex, of pleasure, of the end of the world, of all sorts of things, the culture of the church was always a kind of paranoid fear) to dance in this theatrical, overly dramatic way, we acted int his kind of music hall pantomine, and at the end the bodies were stacked like cordwood into the next song--like rasputin was a kind of heretical mystical reworking of jesus, we were playing the same game, dying and rising again, like we would at the end of the world. i dont know if boney m meant any of that, but the self concicous theatricality of it gave us something before missions and marriages. (maybe thats what im talking about here, self concious theatricality)
Richard Harris' Wrong Song (Donna Summers version is the correct version of this song) the song you are thinking of wrt Harris is the Hive
Lindsay Lohan's video for "Confessions of a Broken Heart (Daughter to Father)" (this is the first video for a pop song that i ever turned off because it was too close to tabloid violence, it isnt reflective at all, and the theraticality is stage managed, the slippages are too raw to be extreme, the blood doesnt come from cornstarch and food colouring; i think what you might be looking for is the britney video for lucky, which does everything about fame that lohan's video does, but more knowingly, or britneys everytime, which talks about internal violence more theatrically) (or maybe im just obessed with how much the wounds in the video look like stigmata)
Johnny Ray (havent heard him enough)
The Shangri-Las were the place i started to love pop more then anything else, it was the place that let me into super pop...the sheer overwrought emotion, the real violence, the silence at the edges (is walking in the sand really about rape?), all makes it extreme, what might make it not is a dependence on authority figures (esp mothers, in the text and phil spector outside the text)
Little Richard for sure (what happens with the exteremity of little richard with the evil hoodoo of pat boone?)
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2006-06-05 08:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-05 08:40 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-05 09:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 09:07 am (UTC)To be a pop star and a punk star at once - what I've heard from The Veronicas doesn't convince me. Assuming the trad defns of 'pop star' and 'punk star', you're right in that Britney and Ashlee are ruled out, and yes I think I agree re Avril too because she's never seemed disturbed enough to be punk. Possibly the answer is Xtina again, though her alignment with hip-hop and fondness for trad Hollywood glamour mitigates against it - however I would argue that the collected videos and songs of Stripped are the closest anyone's come to the popstar/punkstar marriage.
no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 09:08 am (UTC)hello
Date: 2007-02-15 01:34 am (UTC)hello
Date: 2007-02-17 12:06 pm (UTC)hello
Date: 2007-03-05 04:29 pm (UTC)hello
Date: 2007-03-07 07:51 am (UTC)hello
Date: 2007-03-07 04:50 pm (UTC)hello
Date: 2007-07-30 11:26 am (UTC)