Guilty Pleasures

[mippy.livejournal.com]

I was looking att he latest issue of Q yesterday int he library and reading through their list of '50 Guiltiest Pleasures'. And it got me to thinking - is the idea of a 'guilty pleasure' inherently rockist? Most of the songs I 'like but shouldn't like' are songs I wouldn't normally listen to except because of association/nostalgic reasons because they're a bit rubbish. But not liking ELO's Living Thing just because the rock canon doesn't like them? And don't even get me started on Macarthur Park...

So does poptimism recognise the concept of the guilty pleasure, or - as it should be - music is music and whether it's the gaspings of a tortured soul or the wall of sound rebuilt in Duplo, what matters is whether it's ANY GOOD AT ALL?

There should be a poll on this, maybe, but I don't have the issue to hand.

Comments

[katstevens.livejournal.com]

I agree. Case study: I think I probably love Las Ketchup because I was quite isolated from 'Asereje' in the way that most of the populace clearly weren't, and as such never wrote them off as Holiday One Hit Wonders. Hence my utter joy at them entering Eurovision for Spain this year!

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I could quite easily defend them.

[mippy.livejournal.com]

Ah, I was discusisng this with someone when I worked in local radio - I was told that if MJ was convicted his records wouldn't be played on air. This seemed bizarre to me. I still think Rock and Roll is a great record, and is anyone going to see Glitter as a role model these days?

[lockedintheatti.livejournal.com]

Well that goes without saying, obviously.

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

sukrat is a kind of sister community to Poptimists, for talking about very unpop music.

[lockedintheatti.livejournal.com]

He also helps fit that definition by being one of the most passionate advocates of certain songs that other members may have written off without proper listening.

[mippy.livejournal.com]

I dislike the whole hipster thing. It bores me.

[byebyepride.livejournal.com]

Lex's rhetoric is Indie not poptimist i.e. he thinks music with guitars and boys is bad and shiny pop with girls and sex is good. But his practice may well be poptimist, since he clearly likes bits of both.

[whalefish.livejournal.com]

People are saying c.f.! YAY!

[whalefish.livejournal.com]

I find the whole guilty pleasures thing a bit confusing really - as if there is music that we're not meant to like, music that's illegal. Apparently I'm meant to be guilty about liking Jet (song, not band), Wired For Sound, Bat Out Of Hell...whyyy? They're good tunes! Especially Bat Out Of Hell!

I have to confess that I did originally listen to stuff like that because I found it funny, but eventually I realised that I enjoyed it because I liked it and thought it was good stuff. Same with a lot of current and current-ish pop music, really.

No such thing as...

[giddyoldgoat.livejournal.com]

The film critic Robin Wood likes to say that there's no such thing as a guilty pleasure - ie it isn't pleasure if there's guilt involved

The magazine Film Comment used to run a 'Guilty Pleasures' column (I think it's where the term first caught on) which allowed toney auteurs and critics to admit that they liked all kinds of rub. When it came to John Waters, his 'guilty pleasures' were all art movies by Bresson, Bergman, Chantal Akkerman etc - END OF FEATURE

[mippy.livejournal.com]

They really wouldn't. I hang out with a lot of people into light opera, or, if in London, Bright Eyes.

Re: No such thing as...

[mippy.livejournal.com]

And why not? A lot of art movies are often emperor's new clothes. Same with records, often. I dislike a lot of canonical things and would take Bennie and the Jets anyday.

[mippy.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I'd agree with this. I know people who are twenty-five and like Level 42. I know they;'re supposed to be naff, but that's because I spend too much time with my head stuck in books.

my guilty pleasures

[dubdobdee.livejournal.com]

avant garde jazz
films where SUDDENLY NOTHING HAPPENS for 12 hours in a row
philosophy
TEH INTERWEBS

Re: my guilty pleasures

[mippy.livejournal.com]

I have a fondness for reading orange Penguins on buses. This might make me a poser. I don't care.

only posing if:

[dubdobdee.livejournal.com]

the orange penguin you are reading is an actual live arctic bird

books (and biscuits): poptimist friendly

i am old enuff to remember when people looked down on PAPERBACKS as a vulgar attack on all culture

Re: only posing if:

[mippy.livejournal.com]

I grew up in Blackburn - reading any book is posing there. FACT.

[sbp.livejournal.com]

I won a cassette of Jordan the Comeback when it was released back in, looks like 1990, and I really like that one. Plus I was familiar with some of their earlier stuff.

I tend not to hang with the light opera crowd. But I have a lot of friends who are into singing choral music and so on.

Re: my guilty pleasures

[lockedintheatti.livejournal.com]

I find avant garde jazz and certain forms of electronic listening music to be far more incomprehensible and indefensible than even Sandi Thom, James Blunt and Westlife. There's just so much pseudery going on with those.

Re: my guilty pleasures

[dubdobdee.livejournal.com]

maybe we react strongly against what we fear being implicated by:

viz "if i like this i will be thought guilty of naffness/pseudery/homopobia/being a bewigged p4edo"

[awesomewells.livejournal.com]

Lex is a total rockist in almost every conceivable way. Rhetorically he's as far away from being a poptimist as possible, especially with all this "Mariah Carey is a litmus test of poptimism" stuff.

[jeff-worrell.livejournal.com]

and for talking about very pop music that doesn't get a look in here, e.g. prog, easy listening

[jeff-worrell.livejournal.com]

I dislike that people use the term in the first place and/or get worked up about hipsters. Get some perspective.

(um, this is not a go at you, mippy)

[carsmilesteve.livejournal.com]

is there a possibility that what it's REALLY about is arguing though. back to ye olde "defend the indefensible" type threads. or at least that having a position that allows you/us to engage in argument (not even discussion) is more FUN than agreeing with everyone?